Even though the Ortega regime has now released the two bishops and 17 priests unjustly jailed- in fact, banishing them from the country and stripping them of their citizenship- this interview of the Jesuit spokesperson which took place before that event is significant. The regime announced the release of the bishops and priests as the result of a dialogue with the Vatican, something which Fr. Tojeira addresses in this interview. He also addresses the fact that several priests were abducted just for praying for Bishop Álvarez; the widely criticized silence of Cardinal Leopoldo Brenes inside Nicaragua about the repression against the Church; the rumor that the Ortega regime was trying to negotiate an agreement with Nicaragua similar to the agreement with China, where the government has a say in the nomination of bishops; and the nomination of Bishops Álvarez and Báez for the Nobel Peace Prize. Fr. Tojeira was named spokesperson for the Jesuits after the government confiscated the Central American University in Managua.
In La Prensa, January 12, 2024
The Jesuit priest José María Tojiera, 76 years old, spokesperson for the Central American Province of the Society of Jesus, in an interview with La Prensa stated that he is completely convinced that the dictatorship of Daniel Ortega and Rosario Murillo maintains a brutal persecution against the Catholic Church in Nicaragua for being a moral force which they fear.
In the interview he shares his assessment about the worsening of the social and political crisis of the country, particularly about the viciousness against the Catholic Church; his opinion about the call of Pope Francis for a diplomatic and respectful dialogue; his closeness to Bishops Rolando Álvarez and Isidoro Mora, from the Dioceses of Matagalpa and Siuna respectively, and to the more than 12 priests unjustly abducted in December 2023; and expresses his admiration for all Nicaraguans who are resisting.
Tojeira, born in Spain and nationalized Salvadoran, was the President of the Central American University (UCA) José Simeón Cañas in El Salvador, a sister institution of the UCA in Managua which was confiscated by the Ortega dictatorship in August 2023.
What do you think of the religious persecution which the Ortega-Murillo dictatorship has maintained against the Catholic Church of Nicaragua?
The religious persecution is the result of a dictatorship which does not want even a glimmer of criticism, or different opinion than that which is imposed from the State, an enraged dictatorship dedicated to creating fear in the population so that they do nothing. The Catholic Church I believe is one of the most important moral forces that exist in the country, even though in general within their messages they tend to have a lot of prudence and respect, but they do not think like the Government, and on not thinking the same and on being a moral force, the regime considers them to be dangerous and seeks to eliminate them. They have eliminated another source of critical thinking, like journalism which has been harshly persecuted.
There is no precedent in the region for a persecution as systematic as that which the dictatorship (of Ortega) has carried out, it is a very cold system, very calculated one of human rights violations. The Ortega-Murillo dictatorship does not know the Christian history and the history of resistance which the Church can have to persecution.
Why do you think the Ortega regime has so much fury toward the Catholic Church, particularly with the bishops and priests which it recently jailed?
I think that the more personality which a member of the Church has and expresses publicly the thinking of the Church, the more fury there is because the dictatorship is not in favor of the common good, respect for people, none of the basic principles of the Catholic Church in terms of social harmony, they are not partisans of social friendship, dialogue, etc. That is why when someone speaks publicly, they are furious with him, because they want to create fear and want no one to speak.
There is hatred for freedom of expression and religion which includes the power to express opinions based on the social doctrine of the Church, and make applications of it, but that is intolerable for the dictatorship. The Church cannot renounce principles, its social doctrine nor evangelical principles.
What assessment do you make of the staging of Ortega of the exposition of photographs of Mons. Rolando Álvarez?
When someone is unjustly incarcerated, saying that they are treating them well is not an excuse for the injustice, this type of behavior not only reveals the injustice but the ridiculousness of the dictatorship.
They have sentenced him to 26 years in jail, they have accused him of betrayal of the country, they have taken away his nationality, there has not been a process with normal standards of a decent legal system, he has not had the right to defense, it has really been an abduction and an unjust incarceration and saying that they are treating him well. What well? Detaining a person unjustly is treating them well? It really is such a lame statement and from people who believe that the rest of us are mentally deficient, it is intolerable, when I see that it makes me sick, thinking about the lame attempt to manipulate which they are doing.
I am a priest, in all the masses that I have, and since I know that they have prohibited praying for Mons. Álvarez and I know that there are other priests who are doing the same in very different places – I hope the Church will take it as an official proposal – always on getting to the part of the Mass which prays for the Church, Pope Francis, the bishop of the country, after mentioning them I say, “And for the bishops jailed in Nicaragua, Mons. Rolando and Isidoro.”
I think that the Church should say that in all Masses, adding to the Pope and the titular bishop of the Diocese where the Mass is being said, to add the names of the two bishops imprisoned in Nicaragua, because the dictatorship is prohibiting that they be prayed for in the Masses. What does a dictatorship have to say, to say how one has to pray in the masses of the Catholic Church? It is absurd! But I think that we should respond with initiatives like these which are very simple, but that show the steadfastness of the Church in prayer, and responds to what Pope Francis has told us, that we should pray for all the bishops, that would be something ideal, I hope the idea spreads, I am thinking about insisting that other priests do it as long as they are in jail, given that it is a normal practice of the Church to pray for the bishops, let us mention these two who are in a really sad and profoundly unjust situation.
Recently Pope Francis made a statement about the imprisoned priests and said that the Holy See continues to invite Nicaragua to a “diplomatic and respectful dialogue.” Do you think that it will be able to be established?
I think that yes, a dialogue will be able to be carried out, but there should always be some terms, and the dialogue should lead to a proposal. What is the proposal? I am convinced that the proposal, on the part of Pope Francis, is the return to democracy, free elections, respect for human rights and the dictatorship had to cease to be one, and for many the only way for this to cease being a dictatorship is for the Ortega-Murillos to leave, that of course they do not want dialogue, so how can you dialogue with someone who does not want to dialogue?
But I think the offer of the Church is always in the sense of seeking a peaceful solution to conflict and that would be to dialogue about the departure of these men from the situation of the dictatorship in which they keep the country, if they accept starting a dialogue about this, it would be ideal.
In Nicaragua many times in the context of the persecution of Ortega against the priests who they have banished, forced into exile and jailed, the silence of Cardinal Leopoldo Brenes has been criticized. What do you think of him?
I think that the criticism of the Cardinal could be a bit unfair. In Nicaragua no one speaks, no can they speak, it is up to us outside, journalists, priests, intellectuals, politicians, stripped of nationality, to be the voice of protest. Of course, one might wish that he speak, but we have already seen what has happened to Mons. Silvio Báez for speaking, Mons. Álvarez, and Isidoro and others more. I think that what the Church is doing is resisting and resisting from the silence. If you would ask the Cardinal, do you believe in the social doctrine of the Church? He is going to say that yes, but that what the dictatorship wants is that they do not speak, and the Church, in order to resist, many times has to become a Church of silence to be able to accompany people and their faithful.
I think that it is good to know the responsibilities that we have in particular moments, it is up to many of us to speak and to others to be silent. In Nicaragua it is a special moment. The Church is being persecuted for being a moral force, they are criticizing priests for the messages they made in 2018, it is as absurd as the situation of Miss Universe who, because she appeared in some photos in internet, some years ago, and that created the idea in the regime that she is a mortal enemy. It is absurd what the dictatorship is producing.
One should be understanding and back the Church of silence within Nicaragua, and speak outside [Nicaragua] about that Church which is repressed, and its leaders unjustly tried and sentenced.
With the detention of two bishops of the Episcopal Conference of Nicaragua, there is a rumor that the regime wants to pressure Pope Francis to name priests who are close to Ortega. Do you think his Holiness will accept this?
I do not think that Pope Francis will allow himself to be pressured by this type of situations, Pope Francis has recognized the courage of the martyr Bishops like Mons. Óscar Romero in El Salvador, Mons. Enrique Angelelli, in Argentina, against the thinking, even of some sectors of the Church who were saying that they should not be declared martyrs.
His Holiness is a Latin American and knows how things work in our countries, and I do not believe that he is going to allow himself to be pressured by this couple with very little moral fortitude and capacity to pressure the Church.
In Nicaragua there are already clandestine ways of living the faith, in other words, careful ways in meetings, Eucharists, but of people who know what the thinking of the Church is. The Church is wise, knows history and knows that these dictatorships, and that particularly this one of Nicaragua, will not last forever.
Do you think that the dictatorship will be able to copy and impose the Chinese model on the Vatican in Nicaragua?
It is very difficult for me to think that the Latin American context can allow Ortega to implement that system, they are going to be more and more alone, I think that it is a regime on its death bed which could last several years, but they do not have popular support, there is a very different tradition in Nicaragua, and China always was an authoritarian country by tradition, by emperors who joined the modernity of the XX century a little late and where there was a very strong peasant revolution, but afterwards continued with that authoritarian situation.
The situation of Nicaragua has had dictators and dictatorial families, but it is pretty different from the Chinese tradition, it is very difficult to fight against the tradition of peoples, and I believe that Ortega-Murillo do not even have the capacity to create a new culture. Just the opposite, they are creating a type of anti-cultural custom, a culture of fear, terror, denouncement, espionage, and that will not last in Nicaragua.
What opinion do you have about the nominations of Bishop Rolando Álvarez and Silvio Báez for the Nobel Peace Prize?
It would be splendid for that to happen, or that Pope Francis at some time would name Rolando Álvarez and Silvio Báez Cardinals, I think that measures have to be taken that clearly show that the direction of Nicaragua is mistaken and that the Church has a different direction, and that civil society does as well. The Ortega-Murillos cannot aspire to this, who are they going to propose? They cannot propose their faithful supporters [for the Nobel Prize] no matter how much they say they are working for the good.
They are two people who I believe deserve a Nobel Peace Prize for their resistance and their work in favor of democracy, human rights, and fundamental values of ethics.
What is your message for Nicaraguan priests?
I am very respectful of people forced to keep quiet, it is very easy to talk from the comfortableness that you have with freedom of expression, but I believe that those priests in Nicaragua who are resisting have much more merit than I or those of us who speak in public, even though they have to remain silent, but they are serving, accompanying and maintaining the faith of the people. I say to them that they are exemplary Christians, that they are people who are giving us an example of fidelity to Christianity, that they are not selling out to a repressive dictatorship, that they continue accompanying the people even though it be from silence. They are admirable for their capacity for resistance.